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Hryllantre
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Post by Hryllantre » Sun Jan 06, 2008 8:38 pm

Alas my knowledge of PC things is zero...

Just for the record I like our start up page but I'm here already...

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Post by Mullog » Sun Jan 06, 2008 8:53 pm

Part of my job is to make websites so I could try to do something, but then I must have som input from you folks on what you expect from it. What is the use of it? What should be in it? How should it look? Give me some suggestions and I will look at it. :-)
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Post by Mullog » Sun Jan 06, 2008 8:58 pm

korexus wrote:So, maybe we should change the name to aaaWorld of aaaKaomaris? That should get us to the top of the list. :wink:

You mentioned it without realising, but another very good way of promoting a site like this is StumbleUpon.
Be careful with what you whish for! In some languages (norwegian for instance) the letter combination aa is an alternative for the letter å which happens to be the last letter in the alphabet. So aaaWok might end up at the bottom of the list, even below wok4, instead of at the top... :)

StumbleUpon is a great tool for wasting time! I use it all the time... hehe. Some time ago i added the main wok page (http://www.kaomaris.com/phpNuke/) as a page I like and I suggest we all do that.
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
- Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.

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korexus
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Post by korexus » Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:44 pm

Mullog wrote: What is the use of it? What should be in it? How should it look? Give me some suggestions and I will look at it. :-)
I think the idea is for it to be a poster for WoK. Not the front page for regular users, but one that sums it up for the first time visitor. I'd probably put it up as the index page for www.kaomaris.com so current weblinks would point to it.

It would need to be eye-catching and interesting, give an idea of what the game is about and make people want to play, but also easy to take in quickly so visitors don't get bored and move on. We have some of these elements on the front page now, but a separate page designed specifically for the purpose could be much better.

Think you can manage all that? :wink:

Another thing which could be useful if we're planning to get lots of visitors in is for the wiki to gain some more articles. I put it together a while ago and trewqh and Saladin did some work on it, but it's far from complete.


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Post by Aussie Gaz » Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:19 pm

A map showing a game in progress on the welcome page would be advantageous I think.

Something from mid game showing a few neutrals still available etc.

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Post by Dragonette » Tue Jan 08, 2008 7:52 am

korexus wrote:
Hryllantre wrote:Could we design an actual cover page which stands 'World of Kaomaris' apart from the other sites just visited. With click here at the bottom it would take us straight to 'http://www.kaomaris.com/phpNuke/' but at least then those potential players would remember it...
*We* can, *I* can't. My artistic ability is about as close to zero as a non-quantifiable entity can get. :wink:

However, if someone wants to design the page, I can put it on the internet and make it work. Are you volunteering?


Chris.
i it comes to it, incase people had not realised i would be willing to help, but this is something that me and i say 3 other people would have to do.

One a reasercher asking you, and others what colours, style, font and layout people would like.

One a planner putting the results into a rough layout for the designer, but first showing kaomaris to see what they think.Then they can change that as neccersary.

One as a designer to make new logo's, fonts and pictures. To give to the planner.

One a maker, making the page properly. Adding finishing touches.

Having all these people working together is very important, as members making a website, need different people doing different jobs, working TOGETHER. If we can find 3 more people we should do ok. I new going to the thing where we made a TV news report, Podcast, newspaper and website, was a good idea. Also having people of different ages, countries, culture, would be a good idea as we can get more of a feel into what people want.

Oh gooly gosh i have hannibalitus.

dragonette

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Post by Mullog » Wed Jan 09, 2008 9:23 pm

I agree with Dragonette that if we are doing a total site redesign then it should be a group that does the job, but for a simple welcome-to-wok presentation page that will be overkill (imho).

There haven't been many comments on what you expect from an introduction page so I will just try to combine the rotating map on the front page with the welcome texts Han wrote with some links and some more text...
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- Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.

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Post by korexus » Wed Jan 09, 2008 9:34 pm

Agreed.

It will be a group job anyway, in so much that if we don't like it we will tell you and if we do like it then we will claim participation. :P

Produce us something fancy, Mr. Website Maker Man and we'll have a look at it. :)


Chris.

PS. At some point, you and I need to have a serious discussion about site re-design. But that can wait awhile as the server seems to be under control again.
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Post by Hannibal » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:09 pm

korexus wrote:So, maybe we should change the name to aaaWorld of aaaKaomaris? That should get us to the top of the list. :wink:

korexus.
You are joking and winking ... but you are not far off the mark! If Al had thought forward 10 years to the era of long lists, he should have called us "Aardvark Wars" or so ...

But no, aaaKaomaris would only come fourth ... after 1870 etc. Numbers before letters, in pbm's list as elsewhere. Just look at lists of plumbers in Yellow Pages (and it DOES work!). AAAPlumbers used to get more calls. But then they were trumped by 1-2-3 Plumbers, who took over got top spot ...

I HAD thought of this (seriously!). My plan was to later launch on pbem "2-player Kaomaris", grabbing 3rd spot, and later, as if new, "10-player Kaomaris", grabbing FIRST spot! Even two of the first 4 spots if Greg Lindahl doesn't can it.

I wanted to spread them over time ... because each time you put in a new listing, you ALSO get into the top-list of 6 latest ANNOUNCEMENTS. So I was aiming for 3 separate hits ...

Having monitored their site over a month. I now have a lot less faith in it being a way for us to recruit (I had my doubts the first time I visited them):
~ that list of 306 sites/games, with us coming near the bottom ...
~ you don't stay in the top box of 6 or so "Announcements" for long - you are bumped from it by 6 new ones per week.
~ it's not at all easy to find; try it; even if you've heard of pbm.com or pbem.com, and search for it, you are taken these days to Shadow Island Games, pushing their "Olympia". You have to scroll down a screen, to small tenth item, to get the list of pbm/pbem games on offer. And then see hundreds.
~ My impression is that this page/list is mainly used by those already in-the-know, basically to talk to each other about new openings in games they share. Not for new people, who would rarely find it anyway.

The nail in the coffin (for pbm as a major route for us, AND for our current web-host), was when I checked back and found we were updated and listed ... but now only among the dregs of "Dead Links" !! I asked Greg why. Our webhost refuses to serve our webpage to his link-checker! So we get relegated to Dead Links. He suggests we shouldn't use a web-host like that ... (see below).

SO: Done that, tried that. Let's forget pbm as our source of new recruits. On to the better ideas - but I only want to use them up once we are READY for new recruits, optimal for converting them. Three more steps ... IMHO.

Cheers,
Han

On Jan 24, 2008 5:12 PM, Bob Roscow <bobroscow@googlemail.com> wrote:

Thanks, Greg. Sorry for the hassle. I see we really should change web-host. But it won't be for months (the site-master just renewed!). So I look forward to you (manually?) promting us from Dead Links back up to the normal list .....

Thanks,
Bye.
Bob


On Jan 22, 2008 11:56 PM, Greg Lindahl <lindahl@pbm.com> wrote:

On Tue, Jan 22, 2008 at 10:37:58AM +0000, Bob Roscow wrote:

> Er, but I see that the game has been "relegated" to that list at the end, of
> Dead Links!! Any idea why?


It refuses to serve your webpages to my link checker.

I've added it to the exceptions list, but you shouldn't be using an
anti-social web host like that.

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Post by korexus » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:20 pm

Hannibal wrote:The nail in the coffin (for pbm as a major route for us, AND for our current web-host), was when I checked back and found we were updated and listed ... but now only among the dregs of "Dead Links" !! I asked Greg why. Our webhost refuses to serve our webpage to his link-checker! So we get relegated to Dead Links. He suggests we shouldn't use a web-host like that ... (see below).
I doubt this is actually anything to do with our webhost, certainly http://www.dead-links.com/ can trace out the site map without a problem.

More likely is that the url has been submitted as www.kaomaris.com and his link checker can't handle the redirect to www.kaomaris.com/phpNuke. If you do submit the site, I recommend you use the second address.


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Post by Mullog » Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:20 am

I was going to suggest the same thing. The problem is probably that we forward the visitors from www.kaomaris.com to www.kaomaris.com/phpNuke.

This should be easy to fix - just update the link at pbem.com - but instead of doing that I suggest we place the coming-soon-new-welcome-to-wok-intro-page here so that any visitors to www.kaomaris.com sees this page.
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Post by korexus » Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:35 am

korexus wrote: WoK used to get some income from advertising, this was gradually scaled back to reduce annoyance, but the banner ads were only removed when I discovered it was them that broke the forums. I wouldn't be averse to a small revenue from discrete sources such as banners or a google search box, but won't put them in unless members agree.

[...]

My thought process was to sign up for Google ad-sense and ad-words. If people used an on site search engine then they'd be supporting Kaomaris as Google would pay us a small amount of money everytime someone followed a sponsored link. We could then put any revenue from this along with some of our capital into having our own sponsored links appearing on Google. Another option is to put pay-per-impression banners back at the top as these slowly accumulate some cash without interfering in users' browsing experience.
Well, I've done a bit of research. Google adsense will allow us to put either a google search box on the site or those word-highlighty things. Either of these options would then generate a bit of cash on a per-click or pay per 1000 impressions basis, so long as we stayed within the Google ToS. (Which, before anyone suggests it, does include not asking you to or giving an incentive for clicking on the links...)

The down side is that the minimum payout for adwords is $100, which we wouldn't reach very quickly, however one payout would be almost the full year's hosting so it would make a nice bonus.

Most pay per impression banner systems require a higher number of visitors than we have (500,000 page views per month, while our peak was 17,320 in November) but there are some out there for smaller sites, albeit with a lower payout rate. Click exchanges like Al had seem a bit pointless really.

So, I guess the questions are
- If there was a google search box to your left, would you use it?
- If the was a banner rotation at the top of the page, would you notice it?
- If some of the words in the forum change colour and became links to other sites, would it annoy you?


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Post by Lardmaster » Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:34 pm

Maybe
Maybe
No
Question everything.

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Post by Hannibal » Mon Jan 28, 2008 10:13 am

Only rarely.
Yes, I'd notice it, and fine.
No, no problem.

Well done looking for income.

Han
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Post by TBert » Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:36 am

- It would only add one click to my google use, so probably.

- Nope. I've trained myself to ignore those.

- Uhm... a little bit. It's the mouse-over popups that annoy me.
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Post by Mullog » Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:01 am

I don't think it would bother me, and I would probably try to use the search.
Is it much work to get this stuff running? We could try it and if it too annoying we remove it again.
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Post by TheDragon » Tue Jan 29, 2008 11:36 am

No

No

And no

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Post by korexus » Tue Jan 29, 2008 1:45 pm

Well, I'm a vote for annoying on the words, but I can live with them if no one else minds. (I don't know if they cause pop ups or not, there is an easy way to find out though...)

Putting the code in shouldn't be any harder than adding anything else to phpNuke. (So 1 minute to 1 month in time!) I'll have a looik when I get home tonight.


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Post by trewqh » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:17 pm

1. If I remembered about it...
2. The ones we had some time ago did catch my attention from time to time, I guess the new ones also will.
3. This I find very annoying, but won't complain if it pays off.
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Post by korexus » Tue Jan 29, 2008 7:37 pm

The search box is on the left and banners are at the top, I'll keep people updated on what cash if any comes in.

The text links turned out to be lines of text which had to be manually inserted. I could put them into the game search page, but they wouldn't fit the forums very well.

Best to use the box and the banners honestly. Google look out for people that are trying to generate cash and do nasty things to their account...


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