Robo Algorithm change.

Post by **korexus** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 9:13 pm

One of the results of the many behind the scenes WoK Duel emails is that the Robot players' algorithm needs changing. Basically, Robos will attack neutrals or players by preference (instead of other robots) all attack choices being made based on the map set up at the start of the turn.

If anyone has any issues with me updating the algorithm (ie it'll upset your plans) please shout up, otherwise I'll change the code in a couple of days...

Chris.

Post by **Donut** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 12:16 am

Hang on... what's the algorithm?

Post by **korexus** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 11:21 am

Currently: Attack the lowest numbered legal province neighbouring the previously attacked province (or home on turn 1)

After the change: Attacking the lowest numbered legal neutral or player owned province if one exists or the lowest numbered legal robot owned province otherwise.

This will stop robots chasing each other round the map and make them have more of an impact on the game.

Chris.

Post by **Hannibal** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 11:57 pm

I know what you meant. But the Roboplayers had a pretty huge impact on all the Duel games so far, we just want to give them yet more impact, and not have to reject a start-map if 2 or 3 of them look clustered and likely to follow each other around.

The new algo (rules for the Robos) says that all the Robos prefer not to attack each other if any other option is available. Normally they go on to the adjacent lowest prov number; but now they'll first look for the lowest adjacent prov number that is human or neutral, and only attack a fellow Robo if there is no human or neutral prov adjacent.

Now those Robos are even more deadly!

Post by **korexus** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 7:57 am

No one's complained, so I've updated the algorithm (but kept the old version, just in case!)

You can see the results on my duel test game here:
http://www.kaomaris.com/phpNuke/modules ... 6&TurnNR=1 (turns 1 to 5)

Note that grey swerves to avoid orange (owned at start of the turn) but still crashes into light blue (they both head for a 'neutral')

Also, on turn 3, Red is hemmed in by robots, so it does attack a robo province, cutting through into violet's province 20. But then, on turn 5 instead of following violet's path, it swings out and grabs a neutral.

Should make things fun! (And no, that is not a comment to say that it wasn't fun before!

)

Chris.

Post by **trewqh** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:35 am

Hmm. Why did Orange take #4 on turn 2, instead of meeting Grey in #3? #3 was the lowest numbered neutral for both of them at the start of the turn.

Post by **korexus** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:46 am

Because RoboOrange's "head" was in 1. So the lowest numbered (and in fact only) target was 4.

Post by **trewqh** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:48 am

Indeed.

Post by **Donut** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 4:59 pm

WOOOOOO

Hang on here. A change to the Robo algorithm is a very bad thing for me. Just look at the southern map in my Duel with Val. Prior to this I had anticipated that the robos would go at each other and had placed armies accordingly. Now they're lined up to attack me?

I don't disagree with the change, but I have planned one of my players according to the original algorithm. Changing it now puts me at risk of being RIPed by them. Also, I recommend that if you change the algorithm so that they preference players... don't start 1 player surrounded by 3 of them.

Kikkertje · Post by **Kikkertje** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:32 pm

Yeah, that would make the game 3 bots vs 3 players instead. Or 1 v 1 v 1 with 3 barbarians.

Post by **Hannibal** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 8:37 pm

Donut wrote:WOOOOOO

Hang on here. A change to the Robo algorithm is a very bad thing for me. Just look at the southern map in my Duel with Val. Prior to this I had anticipated that the robos would go at each other and had placed armies accordingly. Now they're lined up to attack me?

Yep, I've had a look and that wd be seriously unfair on you, Donut. I think Korexus is now out getting a life, getting drunk and getting a hangover, so I thought I'd give you a fast answer, in case you were getting round to doing your orders about now: Kor and I discussed this. Your next 2 turns will certainly be on the OLD rules, to be fair; we'd like you and Val to agree that we make the switch after your Turn 3, two turns from now. Because whenever we make the switch it is bound to be in the middle of SOME games, so that we do it in one hit on the whole Duel engine. Otherwise Kor has to run the old and new systems in parallel. Two turns from now? - if you two don't make that last 3 weeks!

Donot wrote:I don't disagree with the change, but I have planned one of my players according to the original algorithm. Changing it now puts me at risk of being RIPed by them. Also, I recommend that if you change the algorithm so that they preference players... don't start 1 player surrounded by 3 of them.

I agree. In fact, when GMing a Duel game, on average I generate 10 start-maps before I accept one as being fair and interesting (and then the players can toss for sides or whatever). Sometimes the generated map has the Robos boringly clustered, and they'll all head in the same direction. Sometimes it has one player's 3 colours too clustered. Sometimes it looks too uneven, eg one colour surrounded by Robos. And once or twice the OOP screwed it: it had all 3 of one player's colours going later than all three of the other player's colours, not fair.

So yes, we do have to be careful to generate a fair map, as well as one that has the Robos active and affecting things. This new rule-set for the Robos should help in that, and make us have to reject fewer start-maps. As well as a more varied game of hide'n'seek with the Robos!

Still, not bad. I think we got the Robo-rules nearly right first time. Just this one change. It's just a matter of WHEN to make the switch.

Post by **korexus** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:43 pm

Switch is made and (now I've had confirmation from Validon) this game will run on the old rules indefinitley. Anyone else who is unhappy with the change over can have the same compensation for current games)

All other current games (and all new duels) will use the new, improved robot algorithm

Never underestimate the power of a bored, drunken programmer. PS I don't get hangovers.

Chris.

PPS, with regard to Donut's point about setup, I have redesigned the engine, so a GM can re-run turn 0 as many times as needed to get a balanced start map (without bothering anyone with emails). After that, the GM uses a 'publish turn' button to tell the players that the game is ready...