Euro 2004 - The poor TV, PART I

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Nemesis
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Post by Nemesis » Fri Jun 25, 2004 8:33 pm

Sal is right about England using different rules. When an English player gives away a free-kick for high feet they usually look completly bemused :D

Although, the ref gave a free kick for a push and I didn't see a push anywhere. In England it would be given as a goal though and that is why we are complaining.

Rooney going off blew it for England. Portugal were slightly on top when Rooney was in the pitch but England were still creating chances for Owen. Ricardo made a great save from Owen and Owen sliced one just over the bar.

Rooney played deep meaning that the midfield didn't have to go for the perfect pass as Duke suggested, and we were able to build attacks

I would like to know what the neutrals think of Rooney's performance as England has gone into Rooney mania and way over the top. But surely he has been one of the stars and better than Zidane scoring a free kick and a penalty (Don't get how that is amazingly impressive Ben :?: If Beckham scored a free kick and a penalty and the English media called him one of the best players of the tournament you would be on here going mental)

Ben, I cannot understand your idiotic raging about England's commentators. No one in England likes them either!!! I cannot believe you want the English team to fail over two people sitting in a box with a microphone. Do they really have that much influence over you?

They do not represent the thoughts of everyone in England!

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Post by Hannibal » Fri Jun 25, 2004 10:30 pm

I'm a big England fan, but I'd have been embarrassed if the Cambell goal had stood and we'd nicked the game from Portugal! (Delighted but embarrassed). Portugal outclassed England, unfortunately, and desrved the win. We were very poor. Defending too deep, never keeping possession, just blocking and hoofing 90% of the time. Got to practice that bit about passing and taking passes. Same as against France.

Rooney is pretty good, but you're only as good as the team around you, When we just kept giving the ball back to the French and the Portuguese to have another go, Rooney couldn't show much class. Same with Ballach - brilliant player, only showing his brilliance in brief moments, cos the team was bad around him (apart from maybe young Schweinsteiger).

Tonight Greece showed how it SHOULD be done when you go a goal up. They kept playing their way out of defence, not hoofing it away back to the French, keeping possession, taking the play into the opposition half so that they're not just facing unending attacks and giving away pens and free kicks within range. Bad coach, bad tactics, bad ball control, and a keeper who doesn't organise his defence.

Rooney isn't in the same class as Zidane, Ballach, Nedved. Portugal's good cos they have all 11 NEARLY that good......

Nor as good as my player-of-the-tournament so far.......Ibrahimovic for Sweden. He looked class on the ball even before that stunning backwards goal against the Italians. Yes, the English commentators wrongly raved about Owen capitalising on a bad defensive header by Costatino, with a neat flick past the keeper......but it looked ordinary compared with Ibrahimovic's. He and Larsen have made me root for Sweden......or, now, maybe Greece. Hey Denmark did it when they were the 17th qualifier for a tournament of 16 teams!

(For you people in the US, if any of you are reading, I maybe should explain that last bit: When Yugoslavia fell apart as a country, they had to withdraw from the tournament.......and Denmark was down as the team that had most nearly failed to qualify....so the Danish team hurriedly returned from various beaches and gave it a go.....and won!)
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Post by Saladin » Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:17 am

Hannibal wrote:(For you people in the US, if any of you are reading, I maybe should explain that last bit: When Yugoslavia fell apart as a country, they had to withdraw from the tournament.......and Denmark was down as the team that had most nearly failed to qualify....so the Danish team hurriedly returned from various beaches and gave it a go.....and won!)
Not quite correct Hannibal and i should know because i loved the Yugoslavian team back then more than the Dutch. :P

The Yugoslavians were kicked out by Fifa and then Uefa on a sportsboycot because of the trouble in Bosnia and the subsequently destruct. It was an absolute discrage and Yugoslavia was one of the main contenders to win the title that year as their team mainly consisted of the players that won the EC 1 with Red Star Belgrade (voted best team ever btw).

The Danes got their place because they came second in their group after the Yugoslavians.

It was an absolute disgrace that this team got banned from the tournament because of politics...absolute disgrace.
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Post by Saladin » Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:18 am

Rooney is fast en he's a good finisher. Can't say if he would play well in a team that plays very attacking football as then he will have less room to play in. He fits well in the English counter-attack style.

He's a bit like Owen a couple of years back. So he's a very good player, but in no way does he make his fellow team mates better like the real world class players do...he can't really pass the ball properly so that's a shame.
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Post by Duke » Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:05 am

Rooney?....oh you mean Shrek!

I have to agree that he is good but as Sal said, he is no leader that makes the team better. Maybe that comes with age.

Anyway, that Amstel didnt work at all, now did it? When Zorro (Ibrahimovic) stepped up to the point you could tell that he was freaked out and I told everyone that I put all I've got on a miss. Why didnt they switch him for Allbäck earlier and prepare for the penalties?

The largest shame of it all: When the first five players had made their penalties and we were at a tie then all the remaining players in Sweden refused to take their penalties. Mellberg (the captain) then felt that he had to take his responsability as the skipper of the team and step up for the coming one. Naturally he missed. Why do I say "naturally"? 'cos he hasnt shot a penalty EVER. Last time was in a peewee game as a kid. He is not the one to blame here. He didnt have the skills to shoot a penalty but he was forced to try. The people to blame are the covards that refused.

Holland played well however and is probably the better team on a normal basis but I felt that Sweden did have it in them to win.

Well, well. See you in the WC I guess. I hope to see Ireland there as well since I like their fans.

Btw, am I the only one that finds Schweinsteiger to be a funny name?

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Post by Lowebb » Mon Jun 28, 2004 8:41 am

To my friend Nemesis:

Rooney has been good in Euro 2004, probably the best English player along with Lampard BUT he is no Pele as 1 commentator suggested. I commented on Zidane yes and if you compare Rooney v Zidane in Euro 2004 Rooney comes off well, but when I watch football I would far rather anticipate watching Zidane than Rooney, Zidane is still in the top 5 players in the world, Rooney aint anywhere near the top 10.

What was good about the free kick and penalty: You're rated as the best player of the best team in the world. You're standing 20-25 yards out against a "top class" team, its the 91st minute and if you dont score, you'll struggle to qualify, enough pressure yet? Well then lets add some more, its the 93rd minute, last kick of the game, all the above still counts. Score the penalty and you'll be loved, missed it,' you'll be loathed. Not only dies Zidane score, he slams it it the corner. Not Rooney nor any other player in England in 20 years could do that. THAT is what is so good about the penalty and free kick. Before the free kick Zidane was being sick cause of the pressure.

English commentators: Do the English hate them? This I didnt know, if they hate them they dont show it. It is not an idiotic rage, it is (probably my first) well reeasoned rage. I've been listening to them for years and each tournament I listen too they send me more and more crazy. I'd be here all day quoting them. I have loads of English friends and have no problem with the English but come on people, you (commentators) seem to think there is a god given right to win even after 40 years of hurt!!!

"rooney player of the tournament AFTER 2 BLOODY GAMES!!!! "
"rooney new pele"
"11 heros on the pitch ( cause they defended well for 85 mins)" someone tell sven a match last 90 minutes plus injury time

Its only after the tournament they become self critical, it took getting beat by protugal for them to come up with "becks is short on fitness" "terry had a bad tournament" "vassell should have started in fornt of owen during the group stages"

Now I LIKE Alan Hansen and it is no coincidence that hes scotish

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Post by Nemesis » Mon Jun 28, 2004 9:13 pm

When I was asking about Rooney I wasn't trying to suggest he is World Class or one of the top 10 players in Europe etc. I wanted to know how fans from outside England viewed him. Like I said England has gone Rooney mad and you apparently we have already won the next 4 World Cups because we have him :?

He is only 18 and has massive potential IMO.

Ben, I thought you was suggesting Zidane for Player of thr Tournament as you offered him as an alternative to Rooney. I was saying how does he three minute spell make him Player of the Tournament

Commentators, especially John Motson, can be so annoying. John Motson gets on my nerves when he keeps talking about omens all the time.

'The players walked out onto the pitch before a match in 1966 and then they won the whole tournamnet, could this be an omen'

:roll:

Also sometimes a player gets the ball who is in form and he screams their name like they are going to score from 35 yards, then they pass it sideways

The English media are already on about England winning the World Cup as well. We will have an outside chance but they want to build us up as favourites, then they can knock the team down when they fail

I like Alan Hansen and Andy Gray for England matches. They want England to win but don't go over the top, they keep it realistic

I would also like to point out that after a West Brom match I find it very easy to say We should have done this or we should have done that. I blame the ref a lot as well, I bet you do it as an Arsenal fan as well. I bet every nation in world football does it the same.

The English media have gone way over the top with Campbell's disallowed goal. I have already got over it and am looking forward to next season but they have attacked the ref a lot :?

PS, you do realise Zidane was taking his free kick and penalty against David James don't you :wink:

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Post by Lowebb » Mon Jun 28, 2004 9:52 pm

I'm agreeing with most of what your saying Nemesis, you seem to be more objective than some. I agree abotu Hansen and GRay being probably the best commentators about.

1 thing I do want to clear up. I mentioned Zidane as a player of the tournament expecting France to do well. Obviously they didnt and hence Zidane didnt get a chance, making me look red-faced. I did say Nevad though and hes havign a stormer so far, (he'll probably get dropped now)

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Post by Hannibal » Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:53 am

Duke wrote:
Btw, am I the only one that finds Schweinsteiger to be a funny name?
No you're not alone! I find it hilarious too! (It translates pretty much as "Pig-mounter"). I generously conclude that the ancestor who gave the family its name came from a place called Schweinsteig, named as a place where wild pigs abounded and wore tracks going uphill, or even an ancestor who rode into battle mounted on a pig rather than the more usual and prosaic horse........ but I can't shake off the possibility that his ancestor was vouchsafed the name for his sexual, zoophiliac, tendencies......

Han

PS, sorry the last mail went out as a "Guest"....it happens when I log in for private messages, go "back" to get to boards, and assume I'm still logged in. So dumb that I keep repeating the mistake.
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Post by Hannibal » Tue Jun 29, 2004 1:20 am

Saladin wrote:
Hannibal wrote:(For you people in the US, if any of you are reading, I maybe should explain that last bit: When Yugoslavia fell apart as a country, they had to withdraw from the tournament.......and Denmark was down as the team that had most nearly failed to qualify....so the Danish team hurriedly returned from various beaches and gavThe Danes got their place because they came second in their group after the Yugoslavians.
Not quite correct Hannibal and i should know because i loved the Yugoslavian team back then more than the Dutch. :P
I was going to let it pass, but while I'm here on the thread.........

Wow, Sal, you really try hard to manufacture a disagreement!

So which bit of my postscript was incorrect? The fact that Yugoslavia was falling apart at the time? (Slovenia, Croatia and Bosnia-Herzogovina were seceding from Yogoslavia at the time, and the Serbs were being gruesome in Bosnia....) The fact that they had to withdraw from the tournament? ("had to" and "were forced to" mean exactly the same thing). Or that Denmark was down as the team that had most nearly failed to qualify (I thought that, for the sake of brevity, I wouldn't bother to explain how they came to be the replacement by being second in the qualifying group they shared with Yugoslavia, and would just capture the effect, that they were next in line as replacements....simplifying but not incorrect).

You see, your post could just as easily have started "I remember it well....it was so unjust that.......". BUT you chose to start it with disagreeing or correcting me, a dead give-away. Let me guess......if I were you the reply would start with "Don't be so over-sensitive....."! Nope, you and I know you are looking to attack me at will. Tough. :D

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Post by Duke » Tue Jun 29, 2004 7:10 am

Ouch!

Elephant riding conquerer - 1

Islamic holy book hero - 0

*stands by the popcorn mashine "c'mon!"*

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Post by Lowebb » Tue Jun 29, 2004 8:10 am

To Hannibal:

Just a point concerning Beckham. Hes a nonce, he always has been a nonce. He is now a cheating nonce (wife cheating) And will continue to be a stupid nonce.

And you'll get me cross if you compare his free kick against greece to zidanes. His free kick ensured automatic qualification above germany, england still had a chance to the playoffs even if they got beat.

And lets be fair here to england, they are a much better team now than greece were then

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Post by ThinKing » Tue Jun 29, 2004 2:44 pm

Lowebb wrote:[Beckham's] free kick ensured automatic qualification above germany, england still had a chance to the playoffs even if they got beat.
....and France would still have qualified by beating Switzerland and Croatia if we had beaten them!

The pressure was not on Zidane in the way you are making out.

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Post by Hannibal » Tue Jun 29, 2004 3:00 pm

Lowebb wrote:To Hannibal:

And you'll get me cross if you......
Wouldn't want to get you X, X-Wing! :)

You make a good point. I'd forgotten that England also had a second chance, via the playoffs (I thought England were third and out if they lost to Greece but I'm probably wrong). And, of course, Zidane was playing in front of a world audience AT the big event itself. I still think Bex had a fantastic game that game (though lousy in Euro 2004). But I concede. You win. I pass the baton to TK.......

Han
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Post by Hannibal » Tue Jun 29, 2004 3:19 pm

[quote="Duke"]Ouch!

Elephant riding conquerer - 1

Islamic holy book hero - 0

[quote]

Hmmmmm.....since it was you, Duke, who raised the oddity of Schweinsteiger's name......do you realise you're accidentally calling me "Der erobernde Elefantsteiger".......so do I get to play a really big role in the German team??? :) After all, given the sexual innuendo, Elefantsteiger has to be in some way more impressive than Schweinsteiger !!!! :D

Han (with apologies to anyone who was already lost when Duke first raised the issue of Schweinsteiger's funny name!......this is maybe a two-player joke....anyone else want to join in?)
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Post by Nemesis » Tue Jun 29, 2004 6:33 pm

Anonymous wrote:And that was after he'd played his socks off to rescue the game, even passing to himself off the back of Scholes' boot one time....just before carrying the ball, getting fouled, earning the free kick, and scoring from it. You remember the game? ('Course, he did have a bad Euro 2004).
Actually, Teddy Sheringham won the free kick and even offered to take it but Beckham said he wanted to. Well done Becks :D

Beckham was brilliant that day, he usually is for England, along we Owen. Those two usually bail us out whenever we play poorly, which is more often than it should be. But even with those two off form we managed to get to the quarter finals, only going out on penalties.

The England team has improved dramitcally over the last two years, yet whenever we take the lead against a good team we panic badly. If we could sort that out we would be a very good International side

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Post by Duke » Wed Jun 30, 2004 5:38 am

Hmmmmm.....since it was you, Duke, who raised the oddity of Schweinsteiger's name......do you realise you're accidentally calling me "Der erobernde Elefantsteiger".......so do I get to play a really big role in the German team??? :) After all, given the sexual innuendo, Elefantsteiger has to be in some way more impressive than Schweinsteiger !!!! :D

Han (with apologies to anyone who was already lost when Duke first raised the issue of Schweinsteiger's funny name!......this is maybe a two-player joke....anyone else want to join in?)
Yes, I belive most of the others has started to skip our posts in this thread by now. Dont worry, they do that to me all the time. You'll get used to it.

TK will probably soon start to alter our posts as it pleases him.

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Post by Lowebb » Wed Jun 30, 2004 10:26 am

In a 2-2 draw with a poor greece team (at the time anyway) I doubt if anyone was brilliant but credit to beckham, for attaching a set of balls for 30 seconds. And TK, I'm willing to accept France could have qualified after being beated but Zidane still had far more pressure, England are a quality side, Greece werent and the world was watching and EXPECTING France to win, granted England were EXPECTED to beat Greece but no one outside England, Greece and Germany cared infact I'd bet no one in Greece cared.

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Post by gm_al » Mon Jul 05, 2004 8:46 am

** Latest adult news (children stop reading here) **

Victoria Beckham broke the world record in gangbanging.

Her shaved c*nt f**ked a whole nation in just under 20 minutes.... :roll: :P

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